In Book 18, Odysseus, still disguised as a beggar, “[a]nd the one who knew the world” (144), comments to one of the kinder suitors:
So I will tell you something. Listen. Listen closely.
Of all that breathes and crawls across the earth,
our mother earth breeds nothing feebler than a man.
So long as the gods grant him power, spring in his knees,
he thinks he will never suffer affliction down the years.
But then, when the happy gods bring on the long hard times,
bear them he must, against his will, and steel his heart.
Our lives, our mood and mind as we pass across the earth
turn as the days turn . .
as the father or men and gods makes each day dawn.
I, too, seemed destined to be a man of fortune once
and a wild wicked swath I cut, indulged my lust for violence,
staking all on my father and my brothers.
Look at me now.
And so, I say, let no man be lawless all his life,
just take in peace what gifts the gods will send (18.149-63)
What do the lines above reveal about the impact of Odysseus own journey on him? What has he learned? What insights has he gained? What values does he advocate? What other episodes in the poem up to this point contribute to the viewpoint expressed by Odysseus in these lines? Is Odysseus' journey similar or different to Telemachus' journey to manhood? Has Odysseus changed (has he renounced any of his former values or beliefs)?
It seems that Odysseus is telling us to be aware that whatever we have can easily be taken away from us. He says, "So long as the gods grant [man] power, spring in his knees, he thinks he will never suffer affliction down the years." The gods can give you whatever you want, and when people are blessed like this, they tend to forget how easily they can be sent into poverty. Odysseus seems to be saying not to trust or depend on the gods when considering your fortune, and to be aware of what you have (and what others might not have that you do have). When blessed by the gods, humans never feel grateful for what they have, but once it is taken away they feel its loss and realize how much they had before. Odysseus thinks that it is prudent for humans to realize what they have, and be aware of how easily it could be taken away. Odysseus knows this himself, though not in the example he cites as being a beggar ("I too seemed to be a man of good fortune once… Look at me now"). Odysseus has lived with people he cared about until he went to war- and had to spend 20 years without them, struggling to get home. He has been cursed by the gods multiple times, and knows firsthand how easily the gods can change a good situation to a bad one. Odysseus has matured enough to understand that conceit is a fleeting pleasure, and you can go from fame to oblivion in no time at all. Overall, Odysseus is telling the suitors that they cannot expect to live their life of ease forever, as the gods will send them misfortune at some point in their life.
ReplyDeleteOn page 380 Odysseus is trying to get across a message that one should enjoy and embrace what you have not worry about things that they don’t have. In the passage Odysseus says "Look at me now. And so, I Say, let no man ever be lawless all his life, just take peace what gifts the gods will send(18. 162-164)." In this quote Odysseus is summing up his story to Amphinomous about what he has learned on this journey but specifically how everybody does things and takes it for granted. In the middle of Odysseus's long journey he took things for granted and did not realize what situations he is going to but toward the end of his journey he starts realizing how many things he should be enjoying in life. Another thing that he says that truly shows how much he has been taking things for granted lately is "once under his own roof, he and your friends, believe you me, won't part till blood has flowed (18. 170-171)." He is starting to realize that once home you should enjoy it and not take it for granted. The person that would understand this the most in Odysseus because he has been gone for 20 years and now is home. Some of the people in this story are greedy and don’t understand what they have, and Odysseus is trying to say ones does not need wealth and power to live a good live. Another point that needs to be raised is the similarity between Odysseus and his son Telemachus. Both father and son are very determined people and both won’t stop until they get what they want. For example when Telemachus go’s on his long journey to find his father and Odysseus will do whatever it takes to get home. Toward the end of the book both characters changed from very fearless fighters to wiser people.
ReplyDeleteThe lesson Odysseus has learned and is trying to teach is to enjoy what you are given and what you have in life. If you are greedy there will be consequences. Odysseus is telling the suitors "affronting the loyal wife of a man who won’t be gone from kin and country long. I say he's right at hand- and may some power save you, the spirit of the moment he returns to native ground! Once under his own roof, he and your friends, believe you me, wont part till blood has flowed." (380) he is telling Amphinomus and the suitors that they are taking what they have for granted, and instead of appreciating what they have they have. Odysseus is also saying to let the good things happen and come to you instead of treating other people poorly to get good things for yourself. "Just take in peace the gifts the gods will send."(380) Odysseus is saying to be satisfied with what you have and good things will come out of it. Odysseus is teaching Amphinomus to be grateful when the gods make something good happen to him. Odysseus has learned that when the gods force something good upon him to not take it for granted and be happy with what he has been given. The overall lesson Odysseus has learned is not to take the good things in life for granted and be happy with what you have.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus’s lesson that he has learned and wants to pass on to the suitors is that everyone has good times and bad times, and you shouldn't rely on your good luck with no regard for the bad times coming; just take what you get, and don't long for more. He explains, "so long as the gods grant him power, spring in his knees/he thinks he will never suffer affliction down the years" (18.152-3). During times of good luck and youth, men always think the good times will never end and take them for granted. As a result, they act recklessly and don’t give any thought to the consequences. Odysseus laments, “I too seemed destined to be a man of fortune once/and a wild wicked swath I cut, indulged my lust for violence/staking all on my father and my brothers/Look at me now” (18.159-62). He explains that in his past, he had the same experience of feeling invincible and acting on that feeling recklessly; this seems to be referencing the incident with Polyphemus and other times when he was trying to get glory and fame. Then he shows what comes of that, indicating his ragged appearance and state of being. His message is to “let no man ever be lawless all his life/just take in peace what gifts the gods will send” (18.163-4). He believes that nobody should have the right to do anything they want, and that people should only accept what is given to them, instead of trying to take more than their share. In context with the suitors, he is saying that they are taking Odysseus’s absence for granted and using it to take his wealth and try to take his wife. He is warning them while posing as the beggar that their luck will soon run out and bad times will be upon them in the form of Odysseus’s return.
ReplyDeleteIn this passage of the Odyssey, Odysseus’s message to everyone, especially Amphinous and the suitors, is that the gods have all possible power and influence over the lives of men and women on earth. The gods’ can either rain down good or bad times, but you must learn to cope with and take what they give. Odysseus states, “So long as the gods grant him power, spring in his knees, / he thinks he will never suffer affliction down the years" (18.152-153). He explains that when the gods grant men power, many of them take this power for granted and believe that they can have this power forever. However, he then states, “But then, when the happy gods bring on the long hard times, / bear them he must, against his will, and steel his heart” (18.154-155). This dramatically changes perspectives, showing that being that the gods have all power over men, when they decide to bring down hard times over men, men must bear and fight through the many hardships, time and time again against their will. As he describes this, he begins to express this through his own direct experience, "Look at me now. / And so, I say, let no man ever be lawless all his life, / just take in peace what gifts the gods will send” (18.162-164). Odyssey expresses that you must be grateful of what they have, not being too greedy and wanting too much, but accept what is given to you by the powerful gods. Odysseus has traveled through more hardships in his life, due to the gods, than any man could ever imagine. Odysseus has been cursed by the gods time and time again, struggling to get home for over 20 years. As this situation carries over to the suitors in front of him, he is cautioning them because of how greedy they have been all the time he has been gone, leading to the gods to bring on long hard times and for their future to turn shortly.
ReplyDeleteIn this quotation I feel that Odysseus is saying that man is ungrateful for what they have. They take for granted the fact that the gods gave them life and what they have at the moment. Humans always want more, and when they get it, they want even more than that; it is never enough. Odysseus is saying that you should be grateful with what you have because there will be a day where you don’t have anything and you will wish, you had something. I think that Odysseus has experienced this and has learned throughout his journey which is why he is telling this to one of the suitors. He used to be a king of the small kingdom of Ithaca. He probably wish that he was the king of a much larger area. But then he went to the war and is now taking a great journey to get home. He is now disguised as a beggar with nothing else and he probably wishes he was the king again. Odysseus has changed because old ungrateful him would probably never say this. But now he has experienced this change from going from king with land and fortune, to a beggar that has nothing. He now wishes that he was king again and had something, but when he was king, he wished for more. Odysseus is saying in this quote that people are ungrateful and take things for granted when they should be happy with what they have. People should not wish for more because there will be a day where they have nothing.
ReplyDeleteIt seems that Odysseus is telling everyone to be thankful for what you have and don’t take it for granted. Throughout his long and crazy journey, he met all kinds of people and cultures. He even got a taste of what it is like to be a god. But not only that, he was unable to live the life of a king for over 10 years. Everything that Odysseus had as a king meant nothing to him while he was on his journey. Odysseus knows firsthand what it’s like to get nice things taken away from you. All of the suitors in Odysseus’ house want to have his life as a king. They aren’t satisfied with the lives that they live and they want more power and money because they believe that is a “better” life. Odysseus is trying to convey to them that it your life isn’t better if you have money or power. You can live a simple life and still have a great life. It all depends on the way you look at it. “just take in peace what gifts the gods will send” 18.163. The suitors also seem to believe that if you have money the gods will favor you more and bestow more gifts upon you. Odysseus did have help for gods during his journey but he also got harassed by the gods multiple times. He knows that with good gods come bad and hard time from the “bad” gods. Overall, Odysseus has learned not to take things for granted has experienced what a good and bad life is. Odysseus is trying to warn the suitors and even us that we shouldn’t get too caught up in power and wealth because that is not what a good life is.
ReplyDeleteIn this passage from the Odyssey, Odysseus expresses his beliefs to the suitors, still in undercover as a stranger. He enthusiastically explains to them that they need to learn how to not just take without giving back, and stop living the entitled life. This excerpt shows that Odysseus has matured through his journey. In the beginning Odysseus is less modest, boasting and controlling his crew, wanting strangers to remember his name everywhere he goes. For example, when he maims the Cyclops, Polyphemus, he tells the cyclops to tell everyone that Odysseus, Son of Laertes blinded him. As his journey progresses, he takes a more modest approach. His powerful speech in book 18 shows that on his journey he learned to take less for granted, for he did not see his family for twenty years. He yearned for his return to Ithaca. Without giving away who he actually is, Odysseus highlights feats that he conquered through advice. The statement “long as the gods grant him power, spring in his knees, he thinks he will never suffer affliction” (18.154-5) is a reflection on how he was a king once who had acquired all his desires. Then he goes on to say how “then the happy gods bring on the long hard times, bear them he must, against his will” (18.156-7) which is depicting his role in the Trojan War and his harsh journey after the war. Odysseus is saying that you may be lucky now, but you do not know what the gods have in store for you. If one is selfish, greedy, and ungrateful, their future might be unfortunate. Odysseus closes his speech with the statement, “just take in peace what gifts the gods will send” (18.163) concluding that he is advising the suitors to step back and understand that what they have is sufficient and not be greedy for more.
ReplyDeleteI think that Odysseus is trying to convey a message that humans such as the suitors take advantage of people for their own gain. And there are not a lot of truly good people such as Amphinomus. For example,
ReplyDelete"But here I see you suitors plotting your reckless work,
carving away at the wealth, affronting the loyal wife,
of a man who wont be gone from kin and country long," (18.166-169).
This is explaining that the suitors are taking advantage of Penelope and using the palace so they don’t need to buy anything or doing things for themselves. People probable just come to get free things and live like kings for a while. Not all the suitors are very selfish and mislead people but most of the ones that have been mentioned in the book, we can assume are just like Antinous and the others. All they want it to marry Penelope and they will do anything they have too to get that goal. It doesn’t matter what they have to overcome they will be as mean and annoying as possible if they have to they just want to be the king. Odysseus wants them to know how terrible they are so they can realize it and maybe change themselves and then they can leave the palace. If some of them leave he can know that those suitors shouldn’t deserve death and the rest who stayed deserve it. This is because he was giving them a chance and some could have taken if but none did.
I think that Odysseus is trying to convey a message that humans such as the suitors take advantage of people for their own gain. And there are not a lot of truly good people such as Amphinomus. For example,
ReplyDelete"But here I see you suitors plotting your reckless work,
carving away at the wealth, affronting the loyal wife,
of a man who wont be gone from kin and country long," (18.166-169).
This is explaining that the suitors are taking advantage of Penelope and using the palace so they don’t need to buy anything or doing things for themselves. People probable just come to get free things and live like kings for a while. Not all the suitors are very selfish and mislead people but most of the ones that have been mentioned in the book, we can assume are just like Antinous and the others. All they want it to marry Penelope and they will do anything they have too to get that goal. It doesn’t matter what they have to overcome they will be as mean and annoying as possible if they have to they just want to be the king. Odysseus wants them to know how terrible they are so they can realize it and maybe change themselves and then they can leave the palace. If some of them leave he can know that those suitors shouldn’t deserve death and the rest who stayed deserve it. This is because he was giving them a chance and some could have taken if but none did.
In this passage, the message that Odysseus is trying to endorse to the suitors is that humans take things for granted, but instead, they should be thankful for what they have. He said that there is nothing in this earth "feebler that a man" but with the gods blessing, they feel immortal and above everyone else. In this case he is talking about the suitors. "Of all the breathes and crawls across the earth, our mother earth breeds nothing feebler than a man. So long as the gods grant him power, spring in his knees, he thinks he will never suffer affliction down the year” (18. 149-153). The suitors are now rulers of Ithaca, they took it for granted and are too comfortable in their positions without even thinking of what would happen if it was taken from them. Instead, they should be thankful because just like Odysseus, what he cared for most was taken from him and he barely got it back. In conclusion, Odysseus is trying to get the suitors to realize that they should be grateful for what they have instead of taking it for granted. He is not directly warning them by telling the suitors what has been seen in human nature and how we can’t hold on to important things if we aren’t thankful.
ReplyDeleteI believe that there has been a whole lot that Odysseus has learned throughout his rough journey while facing many hardships. He has come to learn things such as the value life and what mortality really is. He gained more knowledge of dangers that can occur to anyone around the world. Throughout his journey he had endured so much misery and he learned how short life can be to someone and how to never be able to take something for granted. All the things he has ever owned, including his very own family, was violated and taken away from him. He learns that kleos is not the most important thing in life and that it is important that for everyone, family always comes first. Although kleos may always somehow come back to be an option for humans, family should always be the most important priority for anyone. There are many examples of how family is important to many in this book. One of the most important examples is Telemachus’ story. When he grows older, a family is all he wants. He had gone through many hardships, just like Odysseus, to find his father, not even knowing whether or not he was even alive. This shows that Telemachus put family as his first priority, just like Odysseus has learned to do throughout the book as well. Telemachus went through so much and did all he could to find his father.
ReplyDeleteIn the passage above, Odysseus seems to realize that as good as one’s life may seem, one event can immediately turn one’s life in another direction, and he seems to realize that no one is invincible, including himself. Throughout the book Odysseus views himself as invincible, and believes nothing bad could ever happen to him. Odysseus makes this thought clear in his remarks to Amphinomus, “He thinks he will never suffer affliction down the years. But then, when the happy gods bring on the long hard times, bear them he must, against his will, and steel his heart, “(18. 152-155). this example displays how much Odysseus has grown throughout his journey, and what he now believes is valuable. At one point on his journey, Odysseus believed he could never suffer, however his mindset has clearly changed because he is now advocating what he has learned to others who might believe they are invulnerable. Odysseus’s journey seems very different compared to Telemachus’ journey to manhood. Odysseus journey led to the realization that no one is invincible, and he has gone to an “indestructible” man to a man who now knows all the bad in the world. Telemachus journey, however, started as a young boy and led to him believing he could do anything. It is clear Telemachus believes this when he says, “you’ll sense the courage inside me that I know- I’m hardly a flighty, weak-wiled boy these days,” (16. 343-344). At the end of Telemachus’ journey he still believes he can conquer anything, however at the end of Odysseus’s journey he has realized although it may seem he can do anything, he truly cannot. Odysseus’s thoughts and feelings have clearly changed drastically throughout his adventures, from going to “I can do anything” to “I seemed destined to be a man of fortune once”. Odysseus now realizes he is only a mere man and cannot take on the world and every task he is handed without consequences.
ReplyDeleteBruh yall geeks be typin hella much
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